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Epic anyone??

 Post subject: Epic anyone??
PostPosted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 7:56 pm 
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My intro to GW gameing started with Epic, back in the dark ages, i was an avid insane battle tech player, and always wanted more tanks, more mechs, more infanty, i had picked up a copy of the old rogue trader when it first came out, but it mostly gathered dust, later came adeptus titanicus and space marine, i snagged up space marine realy fast and had loads of infantry and tanks i could use with battle tech.

then one day, out of boredom, i picked up the rules book outa the box and started reading it, cool game, was hooked ever since, could fight huge battles with regiments and divisions and heck with all that paper work.

later came 2nd ed Space Marine followed by the titans rules that had the Emperor titan and mega gargant.

3rd edition had some advantages, but it genericized the units too much and i think that is were alot of folks lost the appeal for the game.

4th ed, Armagedon version seems to be a mixture of 3rd ed with some aspects of the very 1st versions thrown in.


Currently i can field

the entire Ultramarines Chapter in epic
the entire Blood Angles Chapter
the entire Dark Angles Chapter
most of the Space Wolves Chapter (6 great companies)

10 imperial guard infantry companies
4 Tank companies
3 Artillary Companies

40 Warlord Titans (mix of the orginal plastic versions and some of the metal versions)
18 Reaver Titans
10 Warhound Titans

12 Emperor Titans (just after GW moved from their wharehouse area over on benson ave in Blatimore MD over to glen burnie, i stoped by the glen burnie gw store and they were unloading the plast emp titans for 15 each or something around that price, was back in 97, snagged all i could get my hands on )


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2007 4:29 pm 
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DEAR GOD MAN that is insane!!! titans are ebast!


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 9:33 am 
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A friend introduced me to an old version of epic but after a few games I found I went off it and didn't play again until I found epic armageddon which is great! I also picked up a lot of stuff but sadly no emperor titans. I've got a massive squat stronghold army though (or demiburg as some people call them) with a couple of hundred bikers, land trains, copters and titan-shattering artillery. I've got an army for every race now other than necrons and tau.

If anyone is interested in starting it's pretty cheap to pick up space marine and ork stuff on ebay, the rest gets a bit more expensive though due to rarity and swordwind the eldar supplement is expensive but you can at least get the rulebooks for free as pdfs.

Post some pics of your titans, I'd love to see them!


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2007 2:35 am 
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Hi Sebuk, welcome to the fringe (haven't been here long myself).

I'd be curious to know what put you off Space Marine? It's almost the best game GW have put out that I've played (I think a really fun campaign of Necromunda with a small group is the most enjoyable GW option).

My one problem with Space Marine was that they made too many lists close combat heavy (Chaos, Orks-with-Goffs, Tyranids) so that games sometimes wound up just a big all-out brawl. But the turn sequence and orders system was definitely the best system for unit-based battles I've played - it forced you to think a bit quicker, without a whole turn of watching the enemy move stuff, ponder where to shoot, and roll dice, before you had to do anything tactical yourself. I stopped collecting when the Imperator titan stuff came out, as I thought that overbalanced things way too much. I've never tried Epic, for the shamefully bad reason that the five guys in a line troop stand looks really sh1t in my opinion. And most of my figures were made obsolete by the rules .

So I'm curious as to what you think is better about Epic... it might be worth taking up.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2007 4:21 am 
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Hi - the feeling I got from space marine was that I was playing 40k with tiny pieces, there didn't seem to be a change of scale to fighting huge battles but I can't really judge it as I only played a couple of games. The main thing though was that our first games took about 4 hours to resolve probably due to some of us not knowing the rules, but still..it seemed too detailed for mass combat.

The other thing that stopped me getting into it was necromunda, it came out and half a dozen gamers I knew rushed out and got a set, so space marine got a bit forgotten.

You can use all your old space marine stuff, 5 in a line and 5 in a square are both valid. It's very fast to play most of our games run from about 45 minutes to an hour and those are big battles with hundreds of troops, tanks, titans and aircraft. There's a real sense that you are fighting a large scale battle and that the things you do really have an impact on your army as a whole. Things are more generalised but in a good way, orks no longer have 40 different tanks that are all more or less the same they have a battlewagon and a gunwagon (plus a couple of bigger vehicles and gargants etc) which makes it all easy to remember and morale is brilliantly modelled so that it can sometimes be easier to rout the enemy then chase them up with some fast attack units and decimate them rather than grind them down. Each of the races really plays differently too, the marines stand their ground, eldar and fast but are very specialised and the orks just roll forwards overwhelming everything until they start to lose lots of troops at which point they start to get a bit nervous and leg it..or fail to respond to your orders in the first place. The imperial guard is also brilliantly brought to life with commisars and officers being the mainstay and a nice variety of units, including the option to make a siege army that stands back and pounds away at the enemy.

If you're worried it all sounds too simplified and might be a bit too basic for you after space marine don't worry, it requires real strategy and tactics to get anywhere while being very easy to get into. My only gripe is the lists for races like necron, tau and chaos are all fan-made though they are very well done and playable but still it would have been nice to pick them all up in a nicely presented rulebook.

Sorry for the long reply, I love the rules and I'm sure if you gave them a go you would enjoy it too. Time to get your soace marine stuff out of that area of warp space known as the attic!

(This is epic armageddon I'm talking about just to be clear, I've never played the original epic.)


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2007 4:28 am 
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Oh yeah, I forgot how long the games lasted with Space Marine. I guess I just had more free time then, so I didn't notice.

I'll go have a look at the Chaos rules for Epic now, I reckon...


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 10:00 am 
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If there's a codex you're looking for that isn't on specialist games give me a shout I've got a good library of fan made army lists for epic armageddon including ones for specific chaos chapters and various setups for IG traitor scum.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2008 1:33 am 
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We still faithfully play Epic withe the 2nd Edition Space marine rules with Titan Legions.

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2008 7:08 am 
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I always used to browse the Epic battles that were written up in White Dwarf (the very few there were) and thought they were pretty interesting, but since i actually bothered to go look at the rules in detail they've destroyed my expectations.

So, i fully intend to rewrite the system from the ground up.
MY interpretation of epic is, EPIC battles using something similar to the 2nd edition 40k rules 'base'.

I always thought that infantry played little to no role in Epic, they were merely cannon fodder to soak up fire that could destroy your precious armour or simply a tool used for capturing important pieces of territory.
Entire units of infantry were denigrated to firing single shots and if they failed their save BLAM! everyone dies.

But damn it that's one of the things I'm going to change, if a unit consists of 5 infantrymen, then they are going to get 5 shots, and have 5 wounds.

This may come as a shock to most Epic players, but Titans will likely be the very last thing i do rules for, heck i may even go so far as to write them out of the game utterly, the basis of Epic SHOULD NOT be who can field the most titans, or whoever loses their titan/s first automatically loses the game.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2008 6:07 pm 
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Yarlen Fireblade wrote:
This may come as a shock to most Epic players, but Titans will likely be the very last thing i do rules for, heck i may even go so far as to write them out of the game utterly, the basis of Epic SHOULD NOT be who can field the most titans, or whoever loses their titan/s first automatically loses the game.


I have to agree, I hate titans. I love the look of Epic and the idea behind it with huge armored columns crashing into defenders of a city or blasting their way through rolling hills leaving nothing but destruction in their wake.

But titans just totally ruin it I think. Besides if you are going to use large models, just stick with 40K

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2008 6:40 pm 
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Personally, I never use Titans with my Craftworld Ulthwe Eldar. I use 2 squadrons of 3 Nighting Interceptors, and a squadron of 3 Phoenix Bombers, and they tear apart pretty much anything my opponent has, including Titans. Also, for the most part in the games that we have here, infantry play an *amazingly* useful role. They don't take on heavy tanks and the like, but take objectives and, with the support of vehicles and aircraft, hold it. Most strategies that people have, however (and I love crushing these players), revolve around Warlord Titans. I've actually take out a Reaver Battle Titan (650 points) with guardians (250 points, 1 unit of farseers, 3 units of scatter lasers, 4 units of guardians, and 3 unit of D-cannons) and a squadron of 3 nightwings (300 points). Besides for 2 attakc runs from the Nightwings, the guardians were totally unassisted, and, with a bit of luck, I took it out, even though it was at full void shields(to begin with) and full damage capacity.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2008 2:24 am 
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Aircraft are my other primary target for significant change or removal. :D


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2008 11:37 am 
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There's no need to change aircraft, because they're already semi-underpowered. If anything, change Vultures! I played Imperial Guard, and I just used 2 infantry companies and a buttload of vultures along with a few hydras and I won, no problem. They've got, what? 120 cm range and at 2+?


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2008 10:51 am 
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My beef isn't so much with aircrafts abilities, they seem relatively weak as is.
It's more with the fact that if for whatever reason you don't bring along your own aircraft and/or units that are alot of the time specifically used for AA then you're helpless against the aircraft menace.

And really we're talking about a universe where your basic trooper is armed with a laser rifle, a rifle that fires a beam at the speed of light and damnit! if that isn't an adequate AA weapon right there i don't know what is.

As an example the United States during Vietnam lost numerous F1 Phantoms (supersonic jets) to ground fire, not AA missiles, not dedicated truck mounted large calibre machine cannons.
I'm talking about infantry bourne small arms, Kaslashnicovs and general purpose machineguns, you put enough projectiles in the air and you'll eventually hit something.

So what i'm going to try and capture is that anything with sufficient situational awareness and reaction time will be able to fire on aircraft, i'm sure a hovering Vampire Raider wouldn't take too kindly to being hit by a Leman Russ battle cannon.
It will simply be a to hit roll modified by target speed, target size and likely distance.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2008 12:16 pm 
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I'm pretty sure stuff like battle and demolisher, vanquisher, etc etc cannons would be *quite* hard pressed to take down aircraft. Small arms, maybe, but not big inaccurate (compared to other weapons) anti-tank weaponry.


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